Posts made by Tuoni

Jacopo just called me and he said, that the next testing phase is starting tomorrow.

@Pluto said in Rhykker Mention of "Pay for Convenience":

@Tuoni

AoC is not a MMO right now, it is a battle royal IIRC. Pretty sure they also sold land/houses etc in their kickstarter. Also, I would not really call them a shining example at this point haha

If you can find a successful mmo with JUST cosmetics, I would be mighty impressed and say that is the exception and not the norm.

The problem with tying yourself to a bad financial model from the get go is you are shooting your own foot. Release is far from the end of the road, stale content will drive people away much faster than a bank space or skill potion will. The thing about convenience items is they give the devs some slack to develop for the actual game, as they are recurrent purchases. Cosmetics do take time, would you rather have a new NPCs art mapped out, or some fluffy wings?

I have come across games where the cash grab was just as real towards cosmetics, and the game grew stale due to lack of content.

I have not talked about cosmetics to be the only income for the company, you have just presumed so. To have a F2P game with only cosmetics in cash shop can ofc be challenging and at least needs a really appealing cosmetics to work out. Combining cosmetic cash shop to B2P or SUBS models is an option.

AoC is a really good example how well cosmetics can sell even the game is at very early development stage. People still bought those even the Apoc side project, but I really hope they won't anymore.

@Pluto said in Rhykker Mention of "Pay for Convenience":

@Tuoni said in Rhykker Mention of "Pay for Convenience":

@Pluto said in Rhykker Mention of "Pay for Convenience":

@Tuoni

BDO has convenience items. Heck, doesn't the new anti p2w archeage have convenience items?

Yeah BDO has convenience items, but I do not have any knowledge about Archeage. Sorry, but I guess I missed your point.

"Many gaming companies do a good amount of money with cosmetics"

I was just saying this statement is pretty false for mmos. Most have cosmetics and convenience items.

I do not see why it is a false argument, because MMOs can make a really good income with cosmetics (if that is their thing and if they want to). This is a very common way especially in Asian MMOs and AoC for example is selling cosmetics like crazy even A1 is not even started.

I was not comparing these to convenience stuff, which can ofc give company even more money, and why those are so tempting to add at first place. Convenience usually milks money at the beginning, but may be bad investment for long term if people are getting against them. Depends ofc a lot of the conveniences itself.

I actually prefer subcription model IF that guarantees totally equal gaming experience without any kind of P2W or P2Advantage stuff.

But what DS has planned so far, I am fine with that too.

@Pluto said in Rhykker Mention of "Pay for Convenience":

@Tuoni

BDO has convenience items. Heck, doesn't the new anti p2w archeage have convenience items?

Yeah BDO has convenience items, but I do not have any knowledge about Archeage. Sorry, but I guess I missed your point.

@Jetah said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Tuoni said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Jetah Yeah I can see your pov, and as much as I would like to see all of this too from real life perspective, It is starting to push the whole flagging system to weird direction. It is totally fine to have a rules in games without need to rationale everything with RL argument.

it wont be RL association at all. the gods are the ones to let the others know even if the player is killed.

i'd like a system where i can kill someone and take their stuff and not get any negative karma for it but i know it wont happen and as a demon it wouldn't be a bad thing either.

Yes, karma and alignment are related for the gods, but thievery and murdering are more like judgements and rules set by humans. There is no reason to go further with the real life argument and think every detail of the flagging system from that aspect. Otherwise we could use RL in everything and end up to have a pretty shit system and game with permanent deaths and life time sentences for example.

@Jetah Yeah I can see your pov, and as much as I would like to see all of this too from real life perspective, It is starting to push the whole flagging system to weird direction. It is totally fine to have a rules in games without need to rationale everything with RL argument.

@Jetah said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Gothix said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Jetah said in Lootable Corpse?:

that should only happen if there's a witness!

Tbh, if he is only unconscious he can report you himself later on. If you were the one who made him unconscious, and he knows it.

For murder though, witness would make more sense.

and what proof that the person that hit them took their goods? what if someone else strolled along and took the items??

Maybe he will be flagged as a criminal then? Assaulting someone is a crime too..

Generally thinking, even someone witnesses a thievery or a murder, what proofs that guy actually has? Word against word? Maybe our characters can just lie if word is enough?

My point is, that maybe we are trying to think this whole flag matter too much from real life point of view.

@Yitra said in Rhykker Mention of "Pay for Convenience":

To me, the whole P2W discussion is about people who don't have the money or do not want to spend it expect to be on par with people who do spend money.

I am not personally going to play a game where skill can be replaced with real money. The whole gaming experience takes a hit if someone can buy his way to the top. I also hate the base idea behind this, to milk money out of the players as much as possible, without doing anything good to the game itself, just harm.

Why would I spend money on things that don't give me anything useful?

Many gaming companies do a good amount of money with cosmetics, so I guess most people are fine to buy atleast something, even those won't give any advantages. However, you can do this a pretty shit way too, like in BDO, most of the ingame armors (even the best ones) makes you look like a clown or beggar, and that way pushes you to buy armor cosmetics from cash shop..

@Pwnstar said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Tuoni said in Lootable Corpse?:

• In human planet you can be flagged as thief when looting corpses.

But a corpse means they are dead. How can you steal from the dead?

Yeah kind of true, but because this is a game and the character is resurrected somewhere else, he still owns those stuff, and maybe can even try to get back to his belongings, depends of the case ofc.

And Jetah makes a great point. How would authorities know who stole what if there are no witnesses?

If we think of this realistically, only if someone else recognize the stuff. However, if we take this road, then won't be much reason to have murder and thief system at first place if in almost every case all witnesses are killed. What about karma? Should we not get any karma hit if we manage to kill all who witnessed the kills? So imo when setting PvP rules for Syndesia the realistic aspect should give less value.

EDIT: Lets forget that karma comment, it is related for gods and this will only lead to existance of gods discussion.

@Znirf said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Tuoni said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Znirf said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Saluko said in Lootable Corpse?:

Not sure if I missed it or not, but will corpses be lootable in pvp ?

Yes, you can loot an unconscious player but, most likely, it will affect you with the criminal status effect thief. In that case, most NPCs will refuse to trade with you and some city guards may decide to attack you.
The only exception where stealing is not considered a criminal action is if the robbed victim is another thief or a murderer.

If you can loot an unconscious player why anyone would want to execute him and take 48h murderer flagged status instead of thiefs 24h?

Nice question! Because the equipped items can be stolen only if you kill the player. If he is unconscious, you can loot only the things that are in his inventory.

Aaaa... okay. I was hoping that there will be some difference. However, I guess most people will execute if they have a chance, because it will give them much more stuff. Like @Gothix mentioned, I presume that thievery will be much more situational and people will loot players who have KO'ed because of PvE. "It is the situation which makes the thief" ...or how it went?

@Znirf said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Saluko said in Lootable Corpse?:

Not sure if I missed it or not, but will corpses be lootable in pvp ?

Yes, you can loot an unconscious player but, most likely, it will affect you with the criminal status effect thief. In that case, most NPCs will refuse to trade with you and some city guards may decide to attack you.
The only exception where stealing is not considered a criminal action is if the robbed victim is another thief or a murderer.

If you can loot an unconscious player why anyone would want to execute him and take 48h murderer flagged status instead of thiefs 24h?

@asspirin said in Lootable Corpse?:

@Tuoni You will be marked as murderer if you execute, not defeat, or im i wrong?

You are right, if you attack someone, but you do not execute him, you will be only flagged as Agressive.

"Hurting a Good or Neutral player doesn’t turn your Alignment to Evil, but flags you as Aggressive – a condition that gets you treated as Evil in many ways. For instance, Good players become able to hurt you, while other Neutral players become able to do so as well without consequences. The Aggressive flag lasts for a few minutes only, but some particularly despicable actions like stealing or executing a player may add additional conditions (such the aforementioned Thief and Murderer flags) that last for a much longer time."

Yes.

• No restrictions on Demon planet.

• In human planet you can be flagged as thief when looting corpses. However, who cares if you have just killed the other player and you are flagged as murderer anyway.

You can read more about PvP rules from here: Feature Spotlight 6 PvP - Alignment - Crime

Here comes some nice armors from different categories.

@Basileus Sure the meaning has changed within years (and it is also very regional), but I guess we should talk about the current version, because it is the one which actually matters. It is quite common attitude, especially in west, that people want gaming be as equal as possible without any kind of paid advantages. There is no rule why pay to win should only mean superiour powers and items, and what you can only buy with real money. People uses P2W nowadays more widely than before, but there is not much what we can do about it. It is very hard to say, that those millions of people are wrong. Anyhow, if we leave the etymology behind and examine the current form of P2W, the general message behind it is very clear, no advantages with real money.

@Znirf said in Healing:

@MrTimo said in Healing:

How is healing going to work in pvp vs pve? Will there be alot of different cleansing spells, buffs, etc...

There won't be any differences between PvP and PvE. We'd like to create a balanced system giving you cooldowns and mana costs that won't allow to spam healings. For example, there will be "consumable spells" that will use your HP as a cost

Hmmm.. Using your own health as healing resource sounds interesting.

@MrTimo said in Healing:

Oh yeah, that quote reminds me, that we need to set attribute points already in character creation, which kind of determines our role(s). Of course we still have freedom to choose our roles, but it might not be efficient to play as a tank with constitution around 10 for example.

@Gothix said in Healing:

@Pwnstar you have that in many games already. Take for example shadow priest in WoW who does similar (vanilla, 15 years ago).

Shadow priest has this spell called Vampiric embrace with 2min. cooldown and which last 15 sec. So yeah there have been such abilities, but we can not think shadow priest as a healer. However, I guess you meant abilities anyway.

It would actually be really fresh to have healer hybrids. It would be cool to play as a paladin for example, which play as a tank-healer hybrid and where your damage based abilities also heals/shields nearby allies.

In addition, there could be a hybrid dps-healer like a shadow priest, which has different kind of leech and drainlife abilities and which also heals your allies.

Of course Fractured does not have classes, but we can kind of create own classes by combining different abilities with different gear.

@MrTimo said in Healing:

How is healing going to work in pvp vs pve? Will there be alot of different cleansing spells, buffs, etc...

I guess we are going to see more build variations in PvP, but more dedication for certain roles in PvE.

And if we just think of the races (especially beastmen), their stat bonuses and differencies supports us taking roles.